What's the difference between...

[Sashalover1]

Hey

I was wondering what's the difference between a belimen (sp) and a catch- foot ?

[melody]

Well a biellman is when the skater grabs the blade of the free leg from the back, and the leg goes all the way up to the head and the legs are almost in a split. Here's a picture of Denise Biellman doing one:
biellman (http://members.shaw.ca/ingridg/dbladyspin.jpg)
another biellman (http://www.sk8stuff.com/f_recog/images/biellmann_selena_s.jpg)

a catch-foot well.. usually the skater would catch the blade of the free leg from the front, i think? but i don't know if the biellman would be considered a catch-foot spin, since after all, the skater does grab hold of the free leg. Sasha's does one too...
catch-foot (http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2004worlds/qualifying/10.jpg)

[rlgfan]

Ok now I have a question,,What is an I spin, I think people call it? I don't know a thing about skating other than I think Sasha is the best right now...Happy Holidays everyone!!

[MKFSfan]

a catch-foot well.. usually the skater would catch the blade of the free leg from the front, i think? but i don't know if the biellman would be considered a catch-foot spin, since after all, the skater does grab hold of the free leg. Sasha's does one too...
catch-foot (http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2004worlds/qualifying/10.jpg)

I think the catch-foot spin is any spin with the skater grabbing their free skate. I think the Beillman falls under this categpry??? I don't know if it matters where-side, in front on behind, if certain positions garner more points or whatnot. There's another version like the Biellman, kinda like a 1/2 Beillman, that's not as difficult or fast, when the skater grabs their skate with one hand and brings it up behind them, doesn't achieve quite the same extension and always seems to slow down the spin. What I hate when skaters allow their knees to drop below their hip line as they grab the skate. Watch Sasha's SL last year and this year, she has a 1/2 Beillman, and at Marshall's she dropped the knee and started to slow down, but I LOVE the different position she does at the end, when she lowers her leg and head.

[AvrilSasha26]

I think this is an I spin
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2002olympics/short/short-ap-5.jpg

and this is a half bielman
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2003abc/long-scar-5.jpg
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2003campbell/ac16.jpg

[danibellerika]

Ok, this is going to get rather lengthy especially since you didn't specify between the spirals, glides and spins. I'll start with spirals.

Sasha's done a half beilmann back spiral:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/screencaptures/2002sears/lp5.jpg

Some people like plushenko tend to hold the left leg up with the left arm which makes it easier (as you can see sasha's holding her left leg up with her right arm).

She's done a bielmann glide:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/screencaptures/2003campbells/cc09.jpg

She's done a half-bielmann spin:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2003campbell/ac16.jpg

With catch foots, there are 3 kinds. Sasha's done the front catch:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2002olympics/short/short-ap-5.jpg

Notice both hands are grabbing her leg b/c it's directly in front.

That's how Sasha does it now, but below you'll see how she used to do it. It looks uglier because the boot isn't pointed up (since you're holding it with your arms) and you can't achieve complete extension like in the pic above:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2000nationals/long/00nlcohenap2.jpg
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2000nationals/exhibition/00adams-1.jpg
Both arms are grabbing the blade. Shizuka and Miki have been doing that spin this way.

She's done the side catch that people call the I-spin:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2002olympics/practice/practice-ap-8.jpg
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2002nationals/long/long-adeff-1.jpg

As you can see, the leg is off to the side and she's grabbing the leg with one arm and grabbing the blade with the other.

Then there is what we call the Y-spin:
http://www.jayadeff.com/Campbells2004/IMG_2549.jpg

As you can see, the free arm and the leg being held make the shape of the Y and the leg is much further out from the body than the I spin.

*whew* That was lengthy. Some people can't tell the differece, but I usually am good at picking out little differences.

[rlgfan]

Thanks everyone for the pics. Now maybe I will know what you guys are talking about..

[Ashley]

What you guys are calling a half-biellman, we call a catch foot. Generally you start out in a camel, then bend your leg, grabbing the blade and pull it up.

[figureskater272]

think of it this way.....a catch foot spin is when you just are holding you leg close to your head and a biellman spin is when your leg is in the shape of a circle....lol.......thats just the way i remember it :)

[loveskating]

I think the catch-foot spin is any spin with the skater grabbing their free skate. I think the Beillman falls under this categpry??? I don't know if it matters where-side, in front on behind, if certain positions garner more points or whatnot. There's another version like the Biellman, kinda like a 1/2 Beillman, that's not as difficult or fast, when the skater grabs their skate with one hand and brings it up behind them, doesn't achieve quite the same extension and always seems to slow down the spin. What I hate when skaters allow their knees to drop below their hip line as they grab the skate. Watch Sasha's SL last year and this year, she has a 1/2 Beillman, and at Marshall's she dropped the knee and started to slow down, but I LOVE the different position she does at the end, when she lowers her leg and head.

The Bielman is different than the typical back-catch spin (see a Sarah Hughes program, she almost always did a very fine back-catch spin, where the leg is extended backwards not up)(not a doughnut spin, that's slightly diffferent.

Thus, they are all "catch spins" except the Bielman, which is arbitrarily differentiated because the leg is brought fully up and extended fully in the back.

What is called Sasha's "I"spin is just a side catch spin, but Sasha's (and Arakawa's etc.) flexibility allows her to pull that side caught leg in much further than the normal "V".

Her front catch is awesome...but I did not realize she ever did it bringing it even closer to her body...thanks Dani!